Why do schools have dances?
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What is more true is the adults don't want to bother to set it up.
Just like no one really wants to chaperone the dance.
But we have figured out that NOT having the dance is worse.
It will leave some kids locked out socially, others will create events that are too adult or unsafe.
We need to show them how it could work. Part of the obstacle to doing this is how few *adults* know how to use social media in a constructive way. So maybe we all need lessons.
As a teacher who is always looking out for kids who struggle with "socializing" the part about being shut out really bothers me.
When I was in HS internet was a secret world for a few dozen nerdy kids who knew about it. Now it's more like the socially savvy kids figure it out, and even manage to use it rather responsibly, but the kids who are more like I was... they have no idea what's going on or where to start and they are just left out.
That sucks.
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F myrmepropagandist shared this topic
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Why do schools have dances? Why do many high schools host parties, sometimes inter-school parties at the school?
A school isn't just a machine that puts knowledge into people's brains, it's an organization of people. And those people will want to celebrate together from time to time. This WILL happen. "official" events can be more inclusive.
But also for young people it's a part of social education, providing some baseline for how you interact with other people.
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In my 20's I worked as Youth Worker, Social Worker and managed several children's centres.
The social education of young people was at the core of everything we did. It worked, so much that I did on occasion run into some of those young people as adults and not only did they remember me... but did so fondly, recounting some of the great memories they had where I worked.
I had a rule where, I wouldn't let kids win a basic games just for the sake of them winning. I challenged them to do better, to think ahead, plan ahead... I wasn't mean or condescending and I would often give ample opportunity for them to see the errors they were about to make... I never gloated, I always congratulated them on a good game.
One of the best memories I have is playing a simple game of Connect 4 with one of the kids... He'd been coming to the after school and holiday clubs for several years. He loved connect 4... but could never beat me... Until he did... at the age of about 10yrs old and after several years of trying.
The look of sheer joy on his face is one I will never forget... talk about a core memory... for both of us. He was celebrating his victory, not in a mocking or condescending way... just pure joy at his achievement beating a far better player.
He was telling everyone, he was the first kid to beat me. When his mum arrived to pick him up it was the first thing he ran up to tell her... and he was giddy with joy.
I ran into him about 15yrs later by chance... When we realised who he was... guess what his first memory of our interactions was... He still beamed with joy recall his win.
I'm a great believer in social education, and I miss those roles I had, helping to shape young minds... But the money was garbage and I didn't want to live in poverty forever... so as I approached 30, I went and got a better paid boring office job for the next 25yrs.
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As a teacher who is always looking out for kids who struggle with "socializing" the part about being shut out really bothers me.
When I was in HS internet was a secret world for a few dozen nerdy kids who knew about it. Now it's more like the socially savvy kids figure it out, and even manage to use it rather responsibly, but the kids who are more like I was... they have no idea what's going on or where to start and they are just left out.
That sucks.
I mean the "secret club for nerds" was not great either but at least it wasn't concentrating social power in the hands of the already socially skilled and powerful.
But, that's what's going on now. Your shy socially awkward kid may at best find some kindred souls online, but at worst?
A chatbot may fill their head with nonsense or they will get preyed on by internet creeps.
And the later was already happening when I was young.
A school should at least set one good example.
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As a teacher who is always looking out for kids who struggle with "socializing" the part about being shut out really bothers me.
When I was in HS internet was a secret world for a few dozen nerdy kids who knew about it. Now it's more like the socially savvy kids figure it out, and even manage to use it rather responsibly, but the kids who are more like I was... they have no idea what's going on or where to start and they are just left out.
That sucks.
@futurebird
For me, the Internet went from the only place I was comfortable in high school to just another social nightmare in the last 10 years. I have wondered what it's like for kids today.It doesn't seem like there's any niche place to express themselves without the threat of bullying at all.
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@futurebird
For me, the Internet went from the only place I was comfortable in high school to just another social nightmare in the last 10 years. I have wondered what it's like for kids today.It doesn't seem like there's any niche place to express themselves without the threat of bullying at all.
They have carved out little spaces on tumblr and instagram.
But they also use discord and things like that a lot.
Discord kind of scares me because who knows what's going on in there? I hope that the older students take to heart our lessons about setting boundaries and asking for help.
But this isn't a new problem, it's always been part of growing up.
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I've had people hear this idea scoff saying "teens will never use it" I don't think this is true. They ALL come to the dances, even though they are "so boring" -- and I think at some level they would feel better having a safer place to express themselves in photos, videos and writing for each other without every creep on the internet looking in on it.
Will some teens still find internet "after parties" Yes.
But right now we are basically saying you can go to the afterparty or NOTHING.
5/5
Darkly? I think the big social media companies do not really want young people to be "empowered digital citizens" or "people who can set boundaries, and make wise choices about the online spaces they participate in"
They want them to be like many adults, kind of helpless and unable to look away from a kind of social media that makes their mental health worse while wasting their time and selling them garbage.
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I mean the "secret club for nerds" was not great either but at least it wasn't concentrating social power in the hands of the already socially skilled and powerful.
But, that's what's going on now. Your shy socially awkward kid may at best find some kindred souls online, but at worst?
A chatbot may fill their head with nonsense or they will get preyed on by internet creeps.
And the later was already happening when I was young.
A school should at least set one good example.
@futurebird There's something in all this that's triggering to me at a pretty deep level and I'm not 100% sure what it is. I think it has something to do with control.
As someone who was manipulated from a young age and who was bullied by kids and adults alike, the Internet for me was a necessary escape. I needed not only to communicate through text but with people outside my community. I didn't really know it at the time but I also needed a place where things wouldn't get back to my parents.
Now I don't know all the social dynamics of how school kids are using social media and I'll readily admit it probably isn't healthy. If kids are getting treated okay in the halls where teachers are watching and then cyberbullied by their peers over lunch, that's bad. And the popularity contest that is IG pretty
.But I'm not sure if social media being a direct extension of school is great, either. For the kids for whom what they say and do making it back to their community is a useful motivatior for good behavior, it may help. But for the kid who everyone has silently agreed it's okay to bully, it just extends that hell to their phone.
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Why do schools have dances? Why do many high schools host parties, sometimes inter-school parties at the school?
A school isn't just a machine that puts knowledge into people's brains, it's an organization of people. And those people will want to celebrate together from time to time. This WILL happen. "official" events can be more inclusive.
But also for young people it's a part of social education, providing some baseline for how you interact with other people.
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@futurebird Also, you do post a lot. Because you think a lot. You're not reposting memes, or even doing the same thing over and over. You're thinking about stuff and sharing those (often very intelligent and unique) thoughts with us, which I find to be a great priviledge, and I would be SORELY disappointed in myself if I ever said anything that made you block me.
@Wyatt_H_Knott @futurebird actually to this point, in the early 00s I got blocked on livejournal by one of my favorite authors and it was actually one of the best things they could have done.
I made some dismissive backhanded compliment because I didn't respect genre writing, and she was having none of that.
When the people you're interacting with have meaning to you beyond the Internet I think it's very good for building better social media skills. -
@futurebird What does 'School' means?
Just a school? In this case "High School" the last four years before a kid will graduate and maybe go to college or start a job.
So school for kids age 14-18 years old?
I don't know if I understood your question.
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@futurebird There's something in all this that's triggering to me at a pretty deep level and I'm not 100% sure what it is. I think it has something to do with control.
As someone who was manipulated from a young age and who was bullied by kids and adults alike, the Internet for me was a necessary escape. I needed not only to communicate through text but with people outside my community. I didn't really know it at the time but I also needed a place where things wouldn't get back to my parents.
Now I don't know all the social dynamics of how school kids are using social media and I'll readily admit it probably isn't healthy. If kids are getting treated okay in the halls where teachers are watching and then cyberbullied by their peers over lunch, that's bad. And the popularity contest that is IG pretty
.But I'm not sure if social media being a direct extension of school is great, either. For the kids for whom what they say and do making it back to their community is a useful motivatior for good behavior, it may help. But for the kid who everyone has silently agreed it's okay to bully, it just extends that hell to their phone.
I think that adults don't do anything about the bullying and have not created any way for students to say it is happening is the real failure.
And if kids want to use the wider internet they still can. I just think what we have now is by default exclusionary since only those kids with parents who help them use the internet, or those with parents who don't care know what's going on at all.
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I think that schools should take on this role.
You could have a server for a school with mastodon, but not connected to the rest of the fedi, you could network with similar schools. Just like at the school dance the teachers are around so there are limits to how it's used.
Teens could post about their soccer games, advertise their clubs, make jokes, practice using the medium wisely.
When teens post to social media they care about their friends at school seeing the post most. 4/
@futurebird who's going to moderate?
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@futurebird who's going to moderate?
Teachers, as we always do for any school activity. Same rules.
But there could also be some work for student government. (we have student government make the dress code and this works well)
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Why do schools have dances? Why do many high schools host parties, sometimes inter-school parties at the school?
A school isn't just a machine that puts knowledge into people's brains, it's an organization of people. And those people will want to celebrate together from time to time. This WILL happen. "official" events can be more inclusive.
But also for young people it's a part of social education, providing some baseline for how you interact with other people.
1/
@futurebird I actually ... don't hate this. Supervision (i.e. moderation) is an issue, but assumably could be done similarly to sports or clubs (putting yet more burden on overworked teachers, but that's another issue.
(But also too: school dances and sporting events and yearbooks all had the express purpose of showing me just how excluded I was from the community. Same will happen with this.)
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@futurebird I actually ... don't hate this. Supervision (i.e. moderation) is an issue, but assumably could be done similarly to sports or clubs (putting yet more burden on overworked teachers, but that's another issue.
(But also too: school dances and sporting events and yearbooks all had the express purpose of showing me just how excluded I was from the community. Same will happen with this.)
(But also too: school dances and sporting events and yearbooks all had the express purpose of showing me just how excluded I was from the community. Same will happen with this.)
That's how I felt about them too. I didn't attend my school's prom, for example.
But I think I would have liked it even less if it was one of those events I wasn't even invited to. (which also existed and only looking back can I see how obnoxious it was that the kids who went had to let me know)
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@futurebird I actually ... don't hate this. Supervision (i.e. moderation) is an issue, but assumably could be done similarly to sports or clubs (putting yet more burden on overworked teachers, but that's another issue.
(But also too: school dances and sporting events and yearbooks all had the express purpose of showing me just how excluded I was from the community. Same will happen with this.)
There was this 1950 style soda fountain where I grew up and it was a big deal to go there for milkshakes on friday's
The entire class except for me and the other two unpopular girls would go.
Very obnoxious. Though that was middle school.
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Why do schools have dances? Why do many high schools host parties, sometimes inter-school parties at the school?
A school isn't just a machine that puts knowledge into people's brains, it's an organization of people. And those people will want to celebrate together from time to time. This WILL happen. "official" events can be more inclusive.
But also for young people it's a part of social education, providing some baseline for how you interact with other people.
1/
@futurebird I thought it was to teach heteronormativity, cisnormativity, "proper" gender roles, etc.
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@futurebird I thought it was to teach heteronormativity, cisnormativity, "proper" gender roles, etc.
Oh that gets in the mix too. But not in the NYC city schools.
They don't really do much "romantic" dancing. They just eat all the snacks and argue about what music to play then dance in a circle.
Which is fine.
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@futurebird I thought it was to teach heteronormativity, cisnormativity, "proper" gender roles, etc.
I guess it will vary by school. Obviously.
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Oh that gets in the mix too. But not in the NYC city schools.
They don't really do much "romantic" dancing. They just eat all the snacks and argue about what music to play then dance in a circle.
Which is fine.
@futurebird Yeah I imagine this has gotten a lot better since when I was there, and that it's a lot better in urban and public education settings compared to rural and private.
