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Chebucto Regional Softball Club

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  3. Epic reduce their cut to 0% for the first $1 million in revenue for devs on the Epic Games Store
A forum for discussing and organizing recreational softball and baseball games and leagues in the greater Halifax area.

Epic reduce their cut to 0% for the first $1 million in revenue for devs on the Epic Games Store

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  • ? Guest
    > I definitely want Steam to lose some market share I want them to have *some* competition...
    MudManM This user is from outside of this forum
    MudManM This user is from outside of this forum
    MudMan
    wrote last edited by
    #43
    Yeah. I mean, same thing. The point is you ideally want multiple players in the PC market competing with each other on features and approach that are all viable, sustainable and give users and developers a better deal as middlemen. I don't want Steam to go away, it's an insanely good client and a great piece of software. But I don't want every game having to be on Steam no matter what and only doing GoG or Epic or Xbox if they are being given a deal or for ideological reasons.
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    • rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.worksR rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.works
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      ilikeboobies@lemmy.ca
      wrote last edited by
      #44
      This goes along with their 0% engine fees
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      • MudManM MudMan
        Yeah. I mean, same thing. The point is you ideally want multiple players in the PC market competing with each other on features and approach that are all viable, sustainable and give users and developers a better deal as middlemen. I don't want Steam to go away, it's an insanely good client and a great piece of software. But I don't want every game having to be on Steam no matter what and only doing GoG or Epic or Xbox if they are being given a deal or for ideological reasons.
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        Guest
        wrote last edited by
        #45
        I like GoG but they don't support Linux, they don't take a smaller cut, and developers are free to submit their games to Steam without DRM.
        MudManM 1 Reply Last reply
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        • ? Guest
          Steam takes 30% at first, and there is a discount after tens of millions of dollars in sales. Steam offers a ton of benefits for game companies through steam, such as the Friends list, reviews, having a way to show live play from the store page, and a bunch of other things. There is a reason that everyone is flocking to steam, and that 30% cut isn't keeping anyone away.
          I This user is from outside of this forum
          I This user is from outside of this forum
          ilikeboobies@lemmy.ca
          wrote last edited by
          #46
          User base and brand loyalty Nothing about what Valve does but you can’t afford to not be on Steam
          rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.worksR 1 Reply Last reply
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          • ? Guest
            Epic only does it because they know they're the underdog. If that were to one day become untrue they would never do anything like this again.
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            Guest
            wrote last edited by
            #47
            And steam doesn't do it at all. One approach is objectively better for the little guys than the other.
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            • MudManM MudMan
              You have given money laundering via making terrible games a suspicious amount of thought. I mean, one could argue that this is on Steam to manage, and that the way to manage it shouldn't be "we'll just keep 30%". It was Steam who spent an inordinate amount of effort and terrible half-assed attempts automating game curation so they could have fewer people looking at approving games the way other first parties do. If Valve wants to Uberify game distribution they have an onus on moderation and on protecting the developers using their platform. But that's irrelevant because nobody needs them to lower their cut to 0%. 20% would be great. 10% would be fantastic. Flipping the current order of things to give more money back to smaller games and keep more money from bigger games would be more than good enough. Whatever arbitrary bar you think would stop this entirely imaginary scheme they could meet and it'd still be an improvement. Hell, I have never laundered money, but from what I hear out there 30% may not be enough to put a stop to that. That may be a decent return for some squeaky clean money out of Unreal asset flips. Should Valve set their cut to 50%? You know, in the interest of international security? That was a serious reach, friend.
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              Guest
              wrote last edited by
              #48
              It's not that strange a thing to think about. Steam partners have abused the system before creating a fuckton of games just for achievements, trading cards and emoticons. Also Banana
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              • ? Guest
                And steam doesn't do it at all. One approach is objectively better for the little guys than the other.
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                Guest
                wrote last edited by
                #49
                Sure, I'm just saying Epic is not any better than Valve in that regard. They're just in a different position.
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                • woelkchen@lemmy.worldW This user is from outside of this forum
                  woelkchen@lemmy.worldW This user is from outside of this forum
                  woelkchen@lemmy.world
                  wrote last edited by
                  #50
                  Reminder that the world's biggest money makers in PC gaming are not on Steam. Minecraft isn't (it's on Microsoft Store and a stand-alone web store), Fortnite isn't (it's EGS exclusive), Roblox isn't (its own store), League of Legends and Valorant aren't (Riot Launcher and EGS),...
                  MudManM 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • I ilikeboobies@lemmy.ca
                    User base and brand loyalty Nothing about what Valve does but you can’t afford to not be on Steam
                    rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.worksR This user is from outside of this forum
                    rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.worksR This user is from outside of this forum
                    rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.works
                    wrote last edited by
                    #51
                    Steam is, in my opinion, way better for the user (even if it may be worse for the developer). Epic lacks features that are important to me like reviews, the ability to view your library in a browser, warnings about DRM, Linux support, a hole bunch of features to discover games, a workshop, big picture mode. Additionally, in my experience at least, their official launcher under Windows is a buggy mess compared to steam.
                    not_rick@lemmy.worldN pory@lemmy.worldP 2 Replies Last reply
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                    • ? Guest
                      Here's a different take, as a game dev: Epic actual employs quite a few people who work with Linux. The Unreal engine (and even, to a certain degree, editor) has native support for Linux. The reasons they're not including Linux support in their store front are two fold: 1) There aren't enough pure Linux users to matter - 0.1% of an already small user base is negligible. 2) The only serious Linux user base in gaming relates to the Steam Deck, a product that pushes a rival (and the dominant) store front. While Valve's move to push Linux gaming is brilliant for us gamers, it also kind of cements us in their camp. There is absolutely no reason for Epic to support Linux in anyway, and it absolutely supports their bottom line to attack it. And, no, it isn't because of any David v. Goliath tale of a little guy standing up to a brute: it's because a fellow giant has decided to ally itself with Linux, and all of us have - invariably - been shuffled into their camp. I think the Epic Games Store has a place in this world as a niche storefront with limited visibility but higher access to sales profits as a result of that. They'll never grow to the size of Steam, and that's okay. The largest storefront in the world supports Linux not just on its platform, but by developing tools for everyone that makes Linux gaming viable. That is enough, IMO.
                      rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.worksR This user is from outside of this forum
                      rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.worksR This user is from outside of this forum
                      rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.works
                      wrote last edited by
                      #52
                      Where are you getting 0.1%? According to [Steam Hardware Survey](https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey) Linux is over 2% of Steam Users. This puts Linux way ahead of Mac which supported by Epic
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                      • rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.worksR rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.works
                        This post did not contain any content.
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                        righthandofikaros@lemmy.world
                        wrote last edited by
                        #53
                        Is this an apology for the bad performance issues of UE5?
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                        • woelkchen@lemmy.worldW woelkchen@lemmy.world
                          Reminder that the world's biggest money makers in PC gaming are not on Steam. Minecraft isn't (it's on Microsoft Store and a stand-alone web store), Fortnite isn't (it's EGS exclusive), Roblox isn't (its own store), League of Legends and Valorant aren't (Riot Launcher and EGS),...
                          MudManM This user is from outside of this forum
                          MudManM This user is from outside of this forum
                          MudMan
                          wrote last edited by
                          #54
                          Yeah. And that's a fantastic showcase of the bar you need to hit to not be effectively toiling in the Steam mines. Assassin's Creed, FIFA, Call of Duty? Not big enough. Still have to deal with Steam. It takes being *significantly bigger than the entire Epic store* to even consider not doing Steam on PC. And none of those is even close to having a viable platform for third party releases outside of Epic, which is perhaps the last one standing on that front and currently not managing to get a foothold. And judging by the rabid fanboy backlash anytime they try to do something nice to attract devs, not even finding a path towards one at any point in the future, either. That's a bad look for competition on the PC market. There aren't that many Fortnites or Minecrafts coming in the future. Gaming investment is drying up and gaming is becoming a cash business, rather than an investment business. And the cash flows to Valve.
                          woelkchen@lemmy.worldW 1 Reply Last reply
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                          • U unexposedhazard@discuss.tchncs.de
                            Until it doesnt and your entire game library is done...
                            woelkchen@lemmy.worldW This user is from outside of this forum
                            woelkchen@lemmy.worldW This user is from outside of this forum
                            woelkchen@lemmy.world
                            wrote last edited by
                            #55
                            For generic SteamWorks integration, there already exists a open source DLL called Goldberg Emulator. If publishers opt for real DRM, the games are not available on GOG anyway. Also, downloading and backing up the games have to be done by yourself before the storefront goes bust. Distributing GOG games outside of GOG is a copyright violation, unless the copyright holders explicitly allow it. So, to sum up: You can backup DRM-free Steam games and make them work with little effort.
                            1 Reply Last reply
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                            • ? Guest
                              I like GoG but they don't support Linux, they don't take a smaller cut, and developers are free to submit their games to Steam without DRM.
                              MudManM This user is from outside of this forum
                              MudManM This user is from outside of this forum
                              MudMan
                              wrote last edited by
                              #56
                              I mean, they don't need to support Linux, you can get an offline installer right from their web app. Even if Heroic didn't solve that problem entirely (which it kinda does) you could still work around it. And I hear this "DRM on Steam is optional" a lot of the time, but it's... kinda not? Even Valve admits their Steamworks integration is a soft form of DRM. Plus the point of GoG is not that you *can* have games with no DRM in it, it's that you *have* to. You buy a game, it's yours to keep. That's a massive paradigm shift. Steam exists *specifically* to avoid that.
                              ? 1 Reply Last reply
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                              • woelkchen@lemmy.worldW This user is from outside of this forum
                                woelkchen@lemmy.worldW This user is from outside of this forum
                                woelkchen@lemmy.world
                                wrote last edited by
                                #57
                                Valve is the only one in PC gaming to push an alternative operating system to Windows. EGS, GOG,... all enforce a Windows hegemony. GOG Galaxy isn't even available on Linux, despite the fact that it's built on cross platform frameworks that make porting easy. Proton by Valve is open source and GOG Galaxy would be free to integrate it. Heroic Launcher is a community effort that shows that it would be possible without massive investments. Epic and GOG/CD Project just chose not to.
                                MudManM 1 Reply Last reply
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                                • MudManM MudMan
                                  I mean, they don't need to support Linux, you can get an offline installer right from their web app. Even if Heroic didn't solve that problem entirely (which it kinda does) you could still work around it. And I hear this "DRM on Steam is optional" a lot of the time, but it's... kinda not? Even Valve admits their Steamworks integration is a soft form of DRM. Plus the point of GoG is not that you *can* have games with no DRM in it, it's that you *have* to. You buy a game, it's yours to keep. That's a massive paradigm shift. Steam exists *specifically* to avoid that.
                                  ? Offline
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                                  Guest
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #58
                                  > Even if Heroic didn't solve that problem entirely (which it kinda does) It actually doesn't. Half the apps I install through Heroic don't work. Meanwhile Steam games work 100% of the time. That's the problem. > Plus the point of GoG is not that you can have games with no DRM in it, it's that you have to. Don't really see the practical difference except that it has like 1% of Steam's library for that reason.
                                  MudManM 1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.worksR rmdebarc_5@sh.itjust.works
                                    Where are you getting 0.1%? According to [Steam Hardware Survey](https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey) Linux is over 2% of Steam Users. This puts Linux way ahead of Mac which supported by Epic
                                    ? Offline
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                                    Guest
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #59
                                    Totally made up, I don't know what % of Epic Games users would play on Linux if given the chance. I'm editing my original message, sorry about that!
                                    1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • ? Guest
                                      > Even if Heroic didn't solve that problem entirely (which it kinda does) It actually doesn't. Half the apps I install through Heroic don't work. Meanwhile Steam games work 100% of the time. That's the problem. > Plus the point of GoG is not that you can have games with no DRM in it, it's that you have to. Don't really see the practical difference except that it has like 1% of Steam's library for that reason.
                                      MudManM This user is from outside of this forum
                                      MudManM This user is from outside of this forum
                                      MudMan
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #60
                                      Yeah, well, I've had better luck with Heroic than Steam proper, even if Heroic is using Proton and Gamescope as well. I guess that's the nature of Linux gaming (still) despite what people like to say. As for the practical difference, it boils down to my GoG library being safely backed up in storage media and preserved safely. If that doesn't matter to you... well, I can't help you, but you're wrong. Either way, if the market broke a different way and GoG had a bigger share (or if Steam matched its policies) that library would not be impacted nearly as much.
                                      ? 1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • woelkchen@lemmy.worldW woelkchen@lemmy.world
                                        Valve is the only one in PC gaming to push an alternative operating system to Windows. EGS, GOG,... all enforce a Windows hegemony. GOG Galaxy isn't even available on Linux, despite the fact that it's built on cross platform frameworks that make porting easy. Proton by Valve is open source and GOG Galaxy would be free to integrate it. Heroic Launcher is a community effort that shows that it would be possible without massive investments. Epic and GOG/CD Project just chose not to.
                                        MudManM This user is from outside of this forum
                                        MudManM This user is from outside of this forum
                                        MudMan
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #61
                                        Sure. They also chose not to have their own layer of controller translation or their own game recording backend. Linux is 2% of the market even on Steam with official support. DRM-free means DRM-free for everybody. I would like more official Linux support, but I'll take good unofficial support in the meantime. There's no workaround for monpolistic positions or mandatory DRM-free policies.
                                        woelkchen@lemmy.worldW 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • MudManM MudMan
                                          Yeah, well, I've had better luck with Heroic than Steam proper, even if Heroic is using Proton and Gamescope as well. I guess that's the nature of Linux gaming (still) despite what people like to say. As for the practical difference, it boils down to my GoG library being safely backed up in storage media and preserved safely. If that doesn't matter to you... well, I can't help you, but you're wrong. Either way, if the market broke a different way and GoG had a bigger share (or if Steam matched its policies) that library would not be impacted nearly as much.
                                          ? Offline
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                                          Guest
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #62
                                          > Yeah, well, I've had better luck with Heroic than Steam proper I don't believe you. > it boils down to my GoG library being safely backed up in storage media and preserved safely You can do the same with DRM-free Steam games. If you don't understand that, I can't help you but you're wrong.
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