@silvermoon82

You can do crypto transfers with python, it's very code-able, but none of the coins are stable enough to make this viable. And, of course, how do you get money into and out of the system?

I do think the payment network problem is important for the alternative web. Using patreon or paypay isn't great.

What about partnering with a credit union?

The problem with money is as soon as you make systems that do anything with money you are swarmed by grifters and need to be perfect.

@silvermoon82

When my mom became interested in bitcoin I decided to learn about it because the way that my mom works is if she wants to know about something she will get into it and you can do it with her... or she will do it on her own. I wanted to keep her safe.

So I learned how the whole thing works. I had some bitcoin left over from years ago and set up a wallet for her. We did transfers with my own code in terminal.

Fun mother-daughter bonding!

@silvermoon82

But if we don't think about money all of these FOSS tools will remain toys for middle class people who don't mind spending a few of their own dimes on keeping them running. It's a barrier to entry. Can it be lowered or knocked down?

@silvermoon82

But if we don't think about money all of these FOSS tools will remain toys for middle class people who don't mind spending a few of their own dimes on keeping them running. It's a barrier to entry. Can it be lowered or knocked down?

Is there a #FOSS self-hosted version of discord?

What about something similar to twitch that does streaming?

One of the reasons twitch is popular is because it's easy to have your audience help support the cost of running your channel. So, systems for micropayment are also an area for possible future expansion.

Or are there technical hurdles or cost hurdles to building such things?
#OSS

@silvermoon82

We had to use coinbase to get the money out and that annoyed me. The alternative was going on facebook and using shady "cash for bitcoin in person" groups. *shudder*

But I can see why people had utopian ideas about the technology.

@futurebird @silvermoon82

#Wero might become the next best thing?

www.wero-wallet.eu

It's kinda Paypal done by European banks (), without any fees.

Not sure if it will be available internationally.

But the two major German coop banking groups are on board, so that might be as good as it gets from a "power to the people" perspective.

@billiglarper @futurebird
In Canada we have Interac email transfers. To and from any (?) Canadian bank account, low or no fee (some small banks still charge $5, I think?), but still subject to opinions of the 6 apex banks so have to be careful about sex and drugs and such.

@silvermoon82 @billiglarper

That is so civilized. Meanwhile in the US they just eliminated the free electronic way to do your taxes.

Not to save money. So that you either have to do the form by hand OR pay one of the many "services" to do your taxes.

Why doesn't that make more people as angry as it makes me? I suppose most people still use the services. And it's just $100 bucks or so, going to whoever and NOT the government.

@silvermoon82

You can do crypto transfers with python, it's very code-able, but none of the coins are stable enough to make this viable. And, of course, how do you get money into and out of the system?

I do think the payment network problem is important for the alternative web. Using patreon or paypay isn't great.

What about partnering with a credit union?

The problem with money is as soon as you make systems that do anything with money you are swarmed by grifters and need to be perfect.

@silvermoon82 @billiglarper

That is so civilized. Meanwhile in the US they just eliminated the free electronic way to do your taxes.

Not to save money. So that you either have to do the form by hand OR pay one of the many "services" to do your taxes.

Why doesn't that make more people as angry as it makes me? I suppose most people still use the services. And it's just $100 bucks or so, going to whoever and NOT the government.

@futurebird @silvermoon82 USDC is stable enough and Solana is maybe an OK solution.

Getting it in and out though, THAT is a huge problem in the USA. First, you have to use an exchange unless you want to find someone that'll trade money for coin (very possibly a criminal). They are all owned and run by terrible people. Then there's the KYC process, which is entirely automated by AI.

Could maybe partner to create a better USDC option for people. Something with real customer support and shit.

@futurebird

"Why doesn't that make more people as angry as it makes me?"

What are you going to do, if you support the idea of a state? Once you accept a state you accept that it can do whatever it wants, in practice, because the alternative is no state and you don't want that.

In this case it's like the state wants you to pay $100 in taxes to a state crony. So yes, historically all states are corrupt. It's a better use of your taxes than funding the military.

Is there a #FOSS self-hosted version of discord?

What about something similar to twitch that does streaming?

One of the reasons twitch is popular is because it's easy to have your audience help support the cost of running your channel. So, systems for micropayment are also an area for possible future expansion.

Or are there technical hurdles or cost hurdles to building such things?
#OSS

@futurebird I have some ideas in my head about writing a self-hosted Discord equivalent. It’s just ideas at the moment, though; 0 lines of code.

@silvermoon82 @billiglarper

That is so civilized. Meanwhile in the US they just eliminated the free electronic way to do your taxes.

Not to save money. So that you either have to do the form by hand OR pay one of the many "services" to do your taxes.

Why doesn't that make more people as angry as it makes me? I suppose most people still use the services. And it's just $100 bucks or so, going to whoever and NOT the government.

@futurebird @silvermoon82 @billiglarper not to upset you more but here in za for the last 3 years i haven't even done my returns. i get a notice from the tax man they're ready for review, i have a quick look, and then do nothing. a few days later the refund is in my bank account

@silvermoon82

But if we don't think about money all of these FOSS tools will remain toys for middle class people who don't mind spending a few of their own dimes on keeping them running. It's a barrier to entry. Can it be lowered or knocked down?

@futurebird @silvermoon82

I have thought GNU Taler could be interesting for payment handling.

GNU Taler - Taxable Anonymous Libre Electronic Resources

A payment system that makes privacy-friendly online transactions fast and easy.

(www.taler.net)

It's a system designed to provide a digital cash like protocol, in use it might actually be kind of like poker chips. It using a form of cryptography to implement it, but it's not a proof of work system like the right wing cryptocurrencies.

Customers would buy tokens from an issuer with some currency, be able to anonymously purchase items from vendors using those tokens, who then can deposit the tokens with a transaction log, and be able to redeem them for the original currency.

The developers have done some test deployments at an EU university and they've got some prototype django websites and android apps available.

I suspect the next actions are doing security review of the code, find a pool of people interested, and figure out governance and business organization issues.

I think doing modest purchases like the prices for I see for quick art commissions or donations (<$40) to a stream probably could be set up with a small business

But to really roll it out my guess would be to found a credit union, and then that could offer issuing taler tokens to it's community

Here's the NCUA documentation on founding a credit union, and they recommended figuring out your community and raising about $500,000 USD to be able to start.

Phase 1: Establishing a Proof of Concept

COMPLETE THESE ACTIVITIES FIRST The purpose of the Proof of Concept is to demonstrate that your concept for the new credit union is well thought-out and contains four elements that are critical to the success of the credit union. These areas are usually the greatest challenge for organizing groups to overcome. You should use the research you perform and the information you have gathered to define your PFCU as a basis for completing your Proof of Concept, demonstrating to the NCUA that your proposal is well thought-out and contains the four major elements crucial to success:

NCUA (ncua.gov)

@alienghic @silvermoon82

This is so cool! I've never even considered the concept of a local non-profit credit union ... you know not for old people. The focus should be digital payment independence.

I assume if you try to do this someone from Mastercard comes to your house and beats you up. But I just found my old bike lock and it is very heavy.